Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

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DarkKman
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:07 am

Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby DarkKman » Wed Oct 30, 2013 6:48 am

Hi folks (again),

I'm working with a band at present that is looking for a seamless set. By that they mean one song goes straight into the next generally being a held synth drone/loop or even riff. I know that "Held Notes over Scene Changes" is a virtual option (I say virtual as its not a button/checkbox but a collection of settings) which I assume is created by ensuring the Instrument you want to hold between scene changes is exactly the same (same MIDI filters/transpose, volumes/inserts etc) with All Notes Off, All Sounds Off, Reset all controllers in Plugins Scene Commands are all unticked.

I have tried this (on a rack I was already using) and its working (kind of). I had a few issues where I noticed a change in tone (and slight click) but discovered that I had a different volume and inserts activated for the following scene - the following scene I don't need the VSTi anymore just the held note from previous scene. I updated so the volume was the same and inserts were the same but there is still a slight click when changing scene.

Now this might be another Instrument tail being clipped (but I think I tried this by muting all other instruments in before/after scenes - I will check again) or the function is a "best effort" and won't be glitch free.

If I save the MIDI Config for the previous scene and apply it to the current scene would this guarantee correct Held Notes over Scene Changes?

I guess I am looking for either someone that uses this (virtual) feature or someone that can say exactly what settings need to be made in previous/current scene to allow this to work. The manual just says "With specific settings on the Scene Commands tab it is possible to hold notes over scene changes" and not what those specific settings are (it may be that the MIDI filters ARE those specific settings. And if there is any reason I'm getting a click when switching scenes?

Hope someone can interpret my gibberish and help an old man with a headache :)

Burtan
Posts: 463
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby Burtan » Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:07 am

Hi,

I am also using this "feature", especially as I use the SceneView background picture to display sheets, which change more often then the actual scene. Thus I must duplicate this scene to use more than one sheet (I'm still hoping that Mike will implement song dependent sheets). Even though, I am sometimes noticing glitches between these scenes, although they are duplicates. Of course Note off and Program Change is turned off on the second duplicate. Still plugins like Absynth still cause glitches (I think there are several, I have never digged deeper into this).

Maybe it is possible to implent a feature, which compares the current scene with the upcoming and only updates the modules which have actually changed.

evilantal
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby evilantal » Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:49 am

I use this all the time..

What works for me is setting all the sounds in the first scene of a song (like you're already doing) and set the "Commands to execute when switching to this scene" to "Auto: Set plugin configuration if it is different from the previous scene" on the "Scene Commands" tab for each plugin module.
Then on all subsequent scenes in the song I set this option to "No: Do not set plugin configuration when changing to this scene".

Viola! Instant scene changes and no glitches. You can still set the volume for each module in different scenes using the bus consoles as these don't affect the plugin blobs.

You can do this much quicker by using the Rack Editor. That way you don't have to click open the gui for each plugin module in each scene.

Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

DarkKman
Posts: 168
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby DarkKman » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:44 am

Thanks for the replies guys... Good to know that this is a "feature" that I'm not alone in figuring out. It looks like I'm on the right track.

The only thing I'm wondering is that I thought, in order for the Kontakt Bank solution to work (i.e. loading libraries into Banks and using Program Changes to change the sounds - see my other thread ), I thought the plugin Scene Command had to be set to "No: Do not set plugin config when changing to this scene" (in fact even this causes some issues but this is the other topic). I understand what you have described for changing scenes within a song but when you change song the setting for THAT scene (in the new song) will be Auto. The issue I seem to remember having is that when set to Auto, Program Changes were not working... I will look into this again is it may be (and highly likely) I missed something.

I noticed the glitch when using OmniSphere so will set up a new test rack and try it from scratch and see what happens (will check out the same with Absynth too). I might be confusing the two issues as for all other VSTis (other than contact) I do already use "Auto: Set plugin configuration" so will check this out again. As for Kontakt I will update my other thread as, although for me they are both related, they are two different issues/queries.

Will update my findings over the next couple of days - thanks for the input so far... Technically everything makes sense just the application of this (or the applier - me :D ) that may be having issues... :mrgreen:

*edit* RACK EDITOR... I forgot about this... That will DEFINITELY save a lot of time! \o/

simac71
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:38 am

Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby simac71 » Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:17 am

Sorry,
so there's no way to play a note on a VST, change the active scene enabling another VST (rerouting the midi input and leaving the old vst active in the rack, obviously not muting or removing the vst), and continue to ear the old vst for the held note and the new vst on the new keystroke?
It should be a matter to send noteoff and controller also to vst that still have some notes playing.
I'd like to play a note with strings on halion change scene holding the keys and start playing piano on kontakt on the same keyboard continuing to ear the strings till I release the key.
Any suggestion?

Ciao

Matteo

evilantal
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby evilantal » Tue Apr 14, 2015 2:21 am

See my reply above...that should work as you suggest when you disable the MIDI port for the strings instrument in the second scene and enable the port for the piano instrument (or channel)

The trick is to set all instrument and effect modules in the second scene to "No" in the Scene Commands tab and only switch sounds by disabling and enabling MIDI ports.

Also make sure "All notes off" and "Rest all controllers" are unchecked in the Scene Commands tab.
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

simac71
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:38 am

Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby simac71 » Mon Apr 20, 2015 5:44 am

Thank you evilantal,
I decided to write to the forum because I tried exactly what you suggested (I previously read it in FAQ section), without success.
Some notes of the Kontakt piano hung.
After your answer I tried again, and I noticed that it happens because I keep them playing, from a scene to the other, with the sustain pedal.
Everything works good (as you suggested) if I keep the notes with the hand. Maybe a kontakt bug (or a feature I cannot understand :)).

Ciao

Matteo

evilantal
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby evilantal » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:28 am

Ah, that is indeed strange...and it only happens with Kontakt?

As I also use Kontakt, I'll try and reproduce it and see if I can figure something out...
What piano are you using in Kontakt?
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

simac71
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:38 am

Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby simac71 » Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:23 am


evilantal
Posts: 389
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:41 am
Location: Arnhem, the Netherlands
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby evilantal » Wed Apr 22, 2015 3:53 am

Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

simac71
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:38 am

Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby simac71 » Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:05 am


evilantal
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Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby evilantal » Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:35 pm

Hey Matteo,

I tried it out on my setup using Kontakt 5 loaded with 8Dio 1969 Legacy and an instance of Alchemy and had it working without a hitch.
This is the configuration I used...

Scene 1:
Kontakt 5: set to "Auto", midi port enabled, all checkmarks off (all notes off, reset controllers, etc.)
Alchemy: set to "Auto", midi port disabled (all checkmarks off)

Scene 2:
Kontakt 5: set to "No", midi port disabled (all checkmarks off)
Alchemy: set to "No", midi port enabled (all checkmarks off)

I could play some piano notes in scene 1, hold the sustain pedal, switch to scene 2 while holding the pedal and the notes continue to sound into scene 2; even though the midi port is disabled on that channel.

Same way Ive been using it for a few years now...
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

simac71
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:38 am

Re: Anyone using Held Notes over Scene Changes

Postby simac71 » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:17 am



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