advice on adding android tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

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lancaster6
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advice on adding android tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:22 pm

i just picked up a winbook 8" tablet pretty cheap. i can't seem to find a windows app where i could design my own virtual mixer surface, add about 12 channels and some assignable knobs for effects, adsr, basic cc controls. any1 using a tablet for this purpose.

edit: windows tablet was traded for android.
Last edited by lancaster6 on Mon May 04, 2015 12:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.

evilantal
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby evilantal » Fri Mar 27, 2015 2:26 am

I use a tablet as well...but an Android tablet. That has TouchOSC and Lemur.

Windows apps that do the same are a bit harder to find it seems.

There's these:


Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

Angel
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby Angel » Fri Mar 27, 2015 3:47 am

Not quite what you want to do, but I use an Android tablet and login to my laptop with the MS remote desktop app (Beta version ist best!). Remote dektop on the laptop enabled under Win7 Pro. This gives me perfect access to Forte scene view.

To connect to the laptop through WiFi, I have a hotspot on the laptops WiFi adapter activated. So the tablet can connect to a WiFi access point hosted on the laptop.

There is a graphic latency of half a second, though. Thats OK for changing scenes in Forte scene view. Might be too much for adjusting values in realtime.

Best,
Angel

snowbird122
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby snowbird122 » Sat Mar 28, 2015 2:46 pm

I've been using a windows tabled with my rig for about 18 months. I use VNC to connect to the PC running Forte. I have a router/switch connected to both devices. This has worked very well for me. Here is a picture of my setup. Notice the tiny bluetooth keyboard (with touch keypad) laying on the right side of the keyboard. This works pretty well too. I have an iphone on top of the windows keyboard, which connects to a separate wifi network and allows me to change my monitor mix on the fly.



Ideally, I'd prefer a simple USB touch monitor instead of a full computer, but I can't find the right form factor yet.

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:36 pm

thx for the replies! after a week and a half of metroosc not working, a reinstall did the trick (pffft). the mixer looks perfect for my needs as long as it has 2 way communication, so that when forte scenes are selected, updated mixer levels will be sent. the graphic latency through wifi kinda sux. a wired solution would be best. any1 know if this is doable without wifi? (i have a feeling i'm on virgin ground here)...

evilantal
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby evilantal » Tue Apr 07, 2015 3:44 am

I don't know about Windows, but Android has native USB tethering support.
I use this with Lemur for a wired control solution.
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:04 pm

after 3 1/2 weeks of attempting to make metroosc work, my brand new winbook tw802 died. frustrating. i had finally gotten the faders to control forte's faders, but the buttons were not working. metroosc offers 0 tech support, and the tutorials are not very helpful. that coupled with the 2 extra pieces of software needed to communicate makes me think the winbook dying was the best thing that could have happened. cannot recommend.
evilantal, does tethering to the android also supply power through the same usb cable, or do you have to make sure the battery is charged beforehand? is there 2 way communication to the android ( do the faders update their visual status upon scene change, etc)? i'd love a software solution, but for now it's back to the korg nano 1 mixer. (the bcr2000 is just so dang huge)!

evilantal
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby evilantal » Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:46 pm

I think it works 2 way if you use a ControlSurfaceDefinition to control only forte's mix (bus and module volumes, transport, effect bypass, etc.).
But I'm not 100% sure as I use it to control synth parameters and those don't have 2way feedback for sure. I can check...

The tablet does indeed charge via the USB, but at least on my Asus Transformer it's a trickle load, so the tablet discharges faster than it charges. Still can get plenty of mileage that way though (at least 10 hours when charged to begin with), so it's not really an issue.

Another way is to use a tool like VPN, Splashtop or something to use the tablet as a wireless external touch display that mirrors the computer screen, like mentioned before.
I tried that route, but could never get the wireless connection reliable enough.
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:48 pm

the 2 way thing (bidirectional) is supposed to be supported, but i haven't figured it out yet. do i need to use echo? i'll have to play around after i get most of the functions i need programmed. i do have one way connection, and it's wired through my powered usb hub (supplying power to the tablet), using usb tethering as a wired connection! so i've got that goin' for me! the reason i want 2 way communication is so that i can set up a lighted switch on the vb3 rotator function (among others) to know if its spinning or not b4 i play. also so the fader's starting point is accurately reflected upon scene change. now i see that there are alot of downloadable preset pages that i will have to sift through. thx all for advice and help.
has anyone gotten the bidirectional thing to work?? if so plz elaborate!!

evilantal
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby evilantal » Wed Apr 29, 2015 3:53 am

Good you got it working so far!

Bidertional only works with Control Surfaces, not with plugin parameters as forte doesn't offer MIDI feedback from plugins.

Ideally, forte would send out the state of all controllers of all plugins through MIDI out upon scene change.

One way of working around this is by using Blue Cat's Remote, for instance, controlling plugin parameters and using the tablet as just an external touch monitor, mirroring the primary display.
The Android app iDisplay supports tethering over USB for this...
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 3:24 pm

hmm I would think ehco might be capable of sending that midi info upon scene change. am I wrong?

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Thu Apr 30, 2015 11:37 pm

i noticed that the charge to the tablet while tethered was just trickle charge. went to altex electronics and they hooked me up with a usb cable that has an extra usb input for a power brick insert. now it gets full charging while usb tethered, with no detrimental effects to lemur. tomorrow is stage test.

evilantal
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby evilantal » Fri May 01, 2015 3:26 am

Great!

Let us know how it goes.

Did you end up using just Control Surface controls in Lemur for bidirectional support?
Lenovo Z500, quad core i7 3632QM, 16GB 1600MHz DDR3, RME BabyFace, Samsung EVO SSD x2, forte 4, Kawai ES100, Kurzweil PC2, VB3, Alchemy, Kontakt 5, Omnisphere 2, Diva, ZebraHZ, Bazille, Pianoteq 5 Standard, Falcon, various effects

lancaster6
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Re: advice on adding windows tablet to rig to use as midi touchpad mixer

Postby lancaster6 » Sun May 03, 2015 5:15 pm

actually, i used it 1 direction this weekend. i am now trying to set up a control surface. i have set up a controller surface definition called "lemur surface", and entered midi and channel parameters for my mixer (although there are 2 midi channel settings per entry, and i don't know why). after doing that, i go into forte and when trying to assign ins and outs, the out column is "greyed out", as in won't let me choose an output. using loopmidi, i have set up a loopmidi in and and loopmidi out, and they are both present and checked on the midi ports pages. why can't i assign the output port on the controller page?


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